First Generation Firebird-L Mailing List Re: Group get togethers... by "Jeff Davis" <Jeff_Davis19@excite.com> Automatic transmission with OD by "Jeff Davis" <Jeff_Davis19@excite.com> Re: Magazines by "Mic" <firemans68bird@yahoo.com> Re: 1969 Firebird Trans Am for sale. by "Mic" <firemans68bird@yahoo.com> Re: 1969 Firebird Trans Am for sale. by "Gary Patrick" <Gary@tcworks.net> RE: PA Birds by "John Clear" <jjclear@my-deja.com> Re: Head flow # comparison (Attn. Niklas) by "John Wern" <jwern@charter.net> Re: 1969 Firebird Trans Am for sale. by "Eddie Pettit" <eddie@thepettitfamily.org> Radiator by "Chris Porter" <fxstsb@pop.sttl.uswest.net> Re: Group get togethers... by "John Wern" <jwern@charter.net> Re: 1969 Firebird Trans Am for sale. [Details] by "Pete D" <pjd805@yahoo.com> Power Top/Manual Top by <SteveBrady1@aol.com> hugo's race car by <Studderin@aol.com> Fast 69 f-bird all pontica by <Studderin@aol.com> Re: 1969 Firebird Trans Am for sale. [Details] by <Studderin@aol.com>
(back) Subject: Re: Group get togethers... From: "Jeff Davis" <Jeff_Davis19@excite.com> Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 16:07:06 -0800 (PST) I'd like to meet with a group from the list. If anyone in the southeast knows of any event within a 400 mile radius of Atlanta, GA, please speak = up! Thanks, Jeff Davis On Fri, 2 Mar 2001 06:40:10 -0600, First Generation Firebird-L wrote: > First Generation Firebird-L Mailing List > = ......................................................................... > It was brought up I think by Geoff about a week ago about getting the First > Gen group together at one of the larger Pontiac shows... As that is a great > idea, it may not be as feasible for anyone on the left coast or the = right > coast to attend, at least with their cars! > > How about setting up multiple gatherings? Like the two main Pontiac = show in > the Mid West, as it has been mentioned there is a show in Mid May in Ocean > City MD, and I'm sure quite a few others... and we have an All Pontiac Show > up here in the North West > this summer. But what I was thinking (and it needs to be expanded on) = is if > we all put our heads (keyboards) together we could come up with a tenitive > schedule of events that would be happening in each region. Then we can > report back on the events as they happen. Then we all have some thing = to > look forward to and all get together in one way or another. And if > traveling, we can plan to catch up with others ion the list. To help = keep > the motivation going all year long... or until that last cruise with = the > heater cranked and the top down before the Bird goes into the Garage = for > it's winter slumber. > > Just a long idea... What do you guy's think? I know I'll be back in the SF > Bay Area > a few times, and perhaps in the CO area at some point, as well as OR = and up > here in > Washington Quake... I mean state! > > Think about it... Brett 67 Drop Top 455 _______________________________________________________ Send a cool gift with your E-Card http://www.bluemountain.com/giftcenter/
(back) Subject: Automatic transmission with OD From: "Jeff Davis" <Jeff_Davis19@excite.com> Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 16:12:21 -0800 (PST) Hi, folks. I've been wondering...could a 4 speed automatic transmission with = overdrive be installed in my '68 350? Anyone had the pleasure of doing it already? Your input would be appreciated. Thanks! Jeff Davis _______________________________________________________ Send a cool gift with your E-Card http://www.bluemountain.com/giftcenter/
(back) Subject: Re: Magazines From: "Mic" <firemans68bird@yahoo.com> Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 16:30:03 -0800 (PST) --- Dean Larson <DLarson@IDENTIFIX.com> > All, > Wondering what car magazines everyone subscribes to. > Tks, > ~Dean Larson > '69 Sport Coupe > High Performance Pontiac Car Craft Hot Rod =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Michael '68 Cameo 400 coupe http://communities.msn.com/Firemans68BirdNest LEARN CPR, IT SAVES LIVES!!!! BE COOL ABOUT FIRE SAFETY!!!! __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/
(back) Subject: Re: 1969 Firebird Trans Am for sale. From: "Mic" <firemans68bird@yahoo.com> Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 16:36:28 -0800 (PST) > Bob.Cisneros@Sun.COM (Bob Cisneros) wrote: > >In some cases, it would also be wise to order the > PHS docs > >directly rather than relying upon whatever the > seller > >presents. --- Framair@aol.com wrote: > ...Bob, you bring up a valid point here. Because > there is a problem > with seller's trying to pass off a car as something > it isn't, documentation > is very important. However, it too can be altered to > represent something > that isn't genuine. For this very reason, the PMD > Billing History copies > being sold by PHS should contain some sort of > 'tamper-proof' feature. > Once upon a time, the copy sent out used to be on a > sepia (brownish) > tone gloss paper. This was somewhat better than a > simple xerox copy. > Better still would be a watermark, stamp or unique > embossed mark. > All of these features can be done without hardly any > significant cost > (ask any print shop). > Even the Sports Card Market has addressed this > matter by printing > cards on special card stock complete with hologram > marks, etc. > One would think that for $35, they would get > something more than > a photocopy of a microfiche card. > > > John > FRamair@aol.com > Semper Fi > Ephesians 4:32 > You make a good point, John. I was a little suprised when I received my PHS documentation and it was just a photocopy. I was expecting something more professional. Don't get me wrong, it is a great service! Maybe there is a way to get in touch with them a make that suggestion? =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Michael '68 Cameo 400 coupe http://communities.msn.com/Firemans68BirdNest LEARN CPR, IT SAVES LIVES!!!! BE COOL ABOUT FIRE SAFETY!!!! __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/
(back) Subject: Re: 1969 Firebird Trans Am for sale. From: "Gary Patrick" <Gary@tcworks.net> Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2001 21:01:38 -0500 Re: 1969 Firebird Trans Am for sale. Bob says>> >N o doubt about it, there have been cases where PHS docs have >been forged, and this is done easily enough given the format >in which they are currently offered. That's why I suggested >that the buyer pursue getting the docs straight from PHS. >Unfortunately, this is time consuming. We should count out blessings. No one else in the hobby can get the documents that PHS offers. I believe that they can be faxed if you are in a hurry too. Do your homework. This reminds me of something that happened recently to me. I was looking thru Hemmings and an ad caught my eye for a 68 triple black 400-4 speed A/C convert for sale. It had an area code close to me so I called . After about 10 messages that I left unanswered over a weeks time I finally got ahold of the seller. His response was rather rude in that "I dont have time to return every call and yes I did get your message that you are very interested in the car. Anyway I got the VIN a;long with some details as current owner said he was the 2nd. He claimed it was originally a 4 speed and did indeed have factory A/C. Humm could this be the illusive 68 4 speed a/c convert that Ive never = seen produced. I then contacted PHS and supplied the VIN. Heres what it turned up... It was a triple black 400 car with factory A/C but it was originally a Th400 car not a 4 speed.That explains the availability of A/C. All in all it was a nice combo,tho it wasnt correct.Upon learning of this I called the seller back and after politely explaining what i had done to check it out he shrugged it off and hung up on me. I hope the buyer knew what he was getting. Gary PS anyone interested I still have the sellers name address and VIN.
(back) Subject: RE: PA Birds From: "John Clear" <jjclear@my-deja.com> Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 18:10:19 -0800 Guys I'm only a couple hours away in South Jersey. There's a nice Pontiac Meet = in Maple Grove sometime in June. My car won't be ready by then, but I'll = still be going. J. >Subject: PA Birds >From: "Keith Donmoyer" <kadonny@hotmail.com> >Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2001 14:38:00 -0500 >Ok, sounds like a plan...however small it might be. Here is the PA >contingency so far for Eastern/Central PA > Jason Rogers from York > Duane Aldrich from Lancaster > Justin from Lancaster > Keith Donmoyer from Pottstown >I know Bull is from the Pocono area, could be to far for him. Maybe = >Reading or up 222 a little farther (torwards Lancaster) would be a >good = area in springtime. >Keith68 H.O. ------------------------------------------------------------ --=3D=3D Sent via Deja.com =3D=3D-- http://www.deja.com/
(back) Subject: Re: Head flow # comparison (Attn. Niklas) From: "John Wern" <jwern@charter.net> Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 22:20:30 -0500 So - and I know little about this. I read this email almost 10 times. = You guys... I have 6x heads on my '77-400 (that is running and in my FB). But = I have 16 heads on my '68-400 (that is sitting in the corner). Should I put the #16 heads on my motor? I dont really understand all this, are there simple terms I can understand?? John. -----Original Message----- From: Tom Grzywacz <ban67shee@hotmail.com> To: Firebird-L@oakmediacreations.com <Firebird-L@oakmediacreations.com> Date: Friday, March 02, 2001 5:40 PM Subject: Head flow # comparison (Attn. Niklas) >First Generation Firebird-L Mailing List >......................................................................... > > >Niklas, > >Found these stock head flow #'s written by Pete McCarthy and High >Performance Pontiac. I went to my friends house to check out his new 428, >afterwards, hopped on his sites, and found these flow #'s. These #'s = should >help clear up any performance issues on different heads.. > > >Tom > > >1967 No. 670 (1967 400 & 428 large-valve--GTO, GP, FB 400)Cast date: J156 >Grade:1 (Note: valve inclination angle decreased to 14=B0 from = 20=B0)Valve >sizes: 2.11/1.77Intake port volume (2 ports): 152.3 & 153 cc'sIntake(D) >Flow (cfm) Exhaust(D) Flow (cfm) Exh./Int. >.100 73 75 .100 39 43 .55 >.200 130 129 .200 76 79 .59 >.300 148 150 .300 100 104 .68 >.400 155 156 .400 117 117 .75 >.500 161 160 .500 122 124 .77 >.600 163 161 .600 129 128 .79 > >1970 No. 12 (1970 Ram Air III 400, D-port)Date cast: H019 Grade: = 1Valve >sizes; 2.11 /1.77Intake(D) Flow (cfm) Exhaust(S) Flow (cfm) >Exh./Int. >.100 73 71 .100 32 .44 >.200 122 126 .200 75 .60 >.300 151 151 .300 102 .68 >.400 162 158 .400 115 .72 >.500 164 162 .500 126 .77 >.600 167 165 .600 132 .80 > >1968-69 No. 16 (1968-69 400 & 428 large-valve D-port)Date cast: A228 >Grade: 2 (1 cfm seat leakage)Valve sizes: 2.11 /1.77Intake port volume (2 >ports): 154 & 154.7 cc's.Intake(D) Flow (cfm) Exhaust(S) Flow (cfm) > Exh./Int. >.100 71 74 .100 46 .63 >.200 126 122 .200 84 .68 >.300 153 155 .300 106 .69 >.400 158 158 .400 124 .78 >.500 162 167 .500 132 .80 >.600 165 167 .600 140 .84 > >1969 NO. 48 (1969 400 "Ram Air III" D-port)Date cast: K308 >Grade: 2 (worn guides)Valve sizes: 2.11/1.77Intake(D) Flow (cfm) >Exhaust(S) Flow (cfm) Exh./Int. >.100 67 75 .100 38 .54 >.200 116 119 .200 77 .66 >.300 148 152 .300 103 .69 >.400 156 159 .400 119 .76 >.500 160 161 .500 128 .80 >.600 165 166 .600 131 .79 > > > >Best performance head 1970 Ram AirIV >Best intake port 1969-70 Ram Air V >Best exhaust port 19681~ Ram Air II >Best D-port head No.16, No.48, No.12 (tie) >Best low-compression D-port head #96 1971 >Best low-compression post-1972 head No.6X >Best balanced head (exhaust to intake)1963421 SD >Best low-lift (under .400) head 1967 No.670 >Worst exhaust-to-intake port ratio 1969-70 Ram Air V >Worst intake-to exhaust ratio 19681/2 Ram Air II >Biggest surprise Intake port, No.17 350 head >Biggest disappointment 1969-70 RA V, 1973-74 455 SD (tie) >Biggest "sleeper" 1975 No. 5C >Most undercammed 1963 SD, 1971 455 HO, 1973-74465 SD (tie) >Mostunderexhausted 1964 GTO (No.9770716) >Most potential for porting 1973-74455 SD, 19681/2 RA II (tie)
(back) Subject: Re: 1969 Firebird Trans Am for sale. From: "Eddie Pettit" <eddie@thepettitfamily.org> Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 22:18:28 -0500 Yes, they can be faxed if you are in a hurry, $10 extra. I just ordered a set of docs for my 67 400, $35. Their site doesn't give you any idea what routine or fax turnaround is. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gary Patrick" <Gary@tcworks.net> To: <firebird-L@oakmediacreations.com> Sent: Friday, March 02, 2001 9:01 PM Subject: Re: 1969 Firebird Trans Am for sale. > First Generation Firebird-L Mailing List > = ......................................................................... > > Re: 1969 Firebird Trans Am for sale. > Bob says>> > >N o doubt about it, there have been cases where PHS docs have > >been forged, and this is done easily enough given the format > >in which they are currently offered. That's why I suggested > >that the buyer pursue getting the docs straight from PHS. > >Unfortunately, this is time consuming. > > We should count out blessings. > No one else in the hobby can get the documents > that PHS offers. > I believe that they can be faxed if you are in a hurry too. > Do your homework. > This reminds me of something that happened recently to me. > I was looking thru Hemmings and an ad caught my eye for > a 68 triple black 400-4 speed A/C convert for sale. > It had an area code close to me so I called . > After about 10 messages that I left unanswered over a > weeks time I finally got ahold of the seller. > His response was rather rude in that "I dont have time to return > every call and yes I did get your message that you are very interested > in the car. > Anyway I got the VIN a;long with some details as current owner said > he was the 2nd. > He claimed it was originally a 4 speed and did indeed have factory A/C. > Humm could this be the illusive 68 4 speed a/c convert that Ive never seen > produced. > I then contacted PHS and supplied the VIN. > Heres what it turned up... > It was a triple black 400 car with factory A/C but it was originally > a Th400 car not a 4 speed.That explains the availability of A/C. > All in all it was a nice combo,tho it wasnt correct.Upon learning of = this > I called the seller back and after politely explaining what i had done > to check it out he shrugged it off and hung up on me. > I hope the buyer knew what he was getting. > Gary > PS anyone interested I still have the sellers name address and VIN.
(back) Subject: Radiator From: "Chris Porter" <fxstsb@pop.sttl.uswest.net> Date: Fri, 02 Mar 2001 19:20:44 -0800 Sorry if this shows up twice, didn't see it come up. Anybody try one of those Desert Cooler 4 core radiator's from Ames ? How does it work ? Did it fit well ? Thanks, thinking of ordering one on Monday. Chris `68 350 H.O. Drop-top
(back) Subject: Re: Group get togethers... From: "John Wern" <jwern@charter.net> Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 22:48:55 -0500 There is a really good car show in North Georgia (up 400) every second weekend of every month. Maybe 50 cars in all...Everything from 50's to = 60's to 70's.Some Barracudas, Buncha Camaros - few Buicks- Some Chevells, Nova here Nova there, Couple GTO's, a Lemans or two, No Firebirds but what was crazy was there were lots of rare MOPAR's. There is one thing for sure they'll have a bird on their hands this year. John. -----Original Message----- From: Jeff Davis <Jeff_Davis19@excite.com> To: First Generation Firebird-L <Firebird-L@oakmediacreations.com> Date: Friday, March 02, 2001 7:41 PM Subject: Re: Group get togethers... >First Generation Firebird-L Mailing List >......................................................................... >I'd like to meet with a group from the list. If anyone in the southeast >knows of any event within a 400 mile radius of Atlanta, GA, please speak up! > >Thanks, >Jeff Davis >On Fri, 2 Mar 2001 06:40:10 -0600, First Generation Firebird-L wrote: > >> First Generation Firebird-L Mailing List >> .......................................................................... >> It was brought up I think by Geoff about a week ago about getting the >First >> Gen group together at one of the larger Pontiac shows... As that is a >great >> idea, it may not be as feasible for anyone on the left coast or the right >> coast to attend, at least with their cars! >> >> How about setting up multiple gatherings? Like the two main Pontiac = show >in >> the Mid West, as it has been mentioned there is a show in Mid May in >Ocean >> City MD, and I'm sure quite a few others... and we have an All Pontiac >Show >> up here in the North West >> this summer. But what I was thinking (and it needs to be expanded on) = is >if >> we all put our heads (keyboards) together we could come up with a >tenitive >> schedule of events that would be happening in each region. Then we can >> report back on the events as they happen. Then we all have some thing = to >> look forward to and all get together in one way or another. And if >> traveling, we can plan to catch up with others ion the list. To help keep >> the motivation going all year long... or until that last cruise with = the >> heater cranked and the top down before the Bird goes into the Garage = for >> it's winter slumber. >> >> Just a long idea... What do you guy's think? I know I'll be back in = the >SF >> Bay Area >> a few times, and perhaps in the CO area at some point, as well as OR = and >up >> here in >> Washington Quake... I mean state! >> >> Think about it... Brett 67 Drop Top 455
(back) Subject: Re: 1969 Firebird Trans Am for sale. [Details] From: "Pete D" <pjd805@yahoo.com> Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 20:12:14 -0800 (PST) What I found interesting is the picture of the motor. Did anyone notice that the a/c compressor and the alternator are on opposite sides from the usual configuration[??]. Is this the typical arrangement for a RA T/A?? Was the accessory bolt-up that much different from say a 400 F/B? Just curious.... PeteJD [69 400/400] Subject: Re: 1969 Firebird Trans Am for sale. From: "Bob Cisneros" <Bob.Cisneros@Sun.COM> Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 14:52:12 -0800 (PST) Tom Grzywacz writes: >I was at the Autorama here in Detroit on Sunday. I saw a white T/A with blue >T/A striping, spoiler..Detatils on window said it was 1 of 7 left...Had R/A >pans, hood, and so on, tried to locate casting #'s on heads...none on ports >that I could see in limited lighting. May be worth looking into. The VIN number would have been of the most help. While all of the 697 VINs are known, the 55 RA IV VINs are printed in Pete McCarthy's book Pontiac Muscle Car Performance 1955-1979. So are the 8 convertible VINs. >(John/Framair) The funny thing is I believe it was a convertible. Ha! I don't think I quite understand. This implies doubt about the car being a convertible? I just searched for Southern Motors, and found a link: <http://www.southernmotors.com/69ta.htm> The caption on the pages indicate that the car is a clone. They want $25K for it. -Bob San Jose, CA 1968 Convertible (I'm sure of it) __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/
(back) Subject: Power Top/Manual Top From: <SteveBrady1@aol.com> Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 23:15:58 EST How can I tell the difference between a manual top frame and a power top frame? I have no idea what mine is, as it came off another Firebird. Can anyone give me soem help? Steve Brady 68 400 Convertible http://members.nbci.com/srb/
(back) Subject: hugo's race car From: <Studderin@aol.com> Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 23:23:12 EST In a message dated 3/2/2001 5:13:40 AM Eastern Daylight Time, hugoba@apcom.com writes: << 'm trying to raise the hind end of the car so that it will clear some = mondo tires (it's only going to run at the drag strip). I have installed some = load leveling leaves that helped a bit but I still get some rubbage. I can also try some (yuck) longer shackles and the last thing will be to = get some re-curved springs from Eaton. Suggestions? Hugo >> Hugo I don't know your exact situation, but I know If you remount your = shocks inside your leafsping it gives you about an additional 2 1/2 of wheel clearance. It's not always bigger tires, a good setup car can do huge destructive wheelstands on a 9-10 inch. slicks. Also I believe that NHRA = and IHRA have a rule about tires can't be outside to fenders. A guy I work with HAD (1975-1999) a 68' nova, he had 15x10 weld = draglites with 5 1/2 inch's of backspacing. He had slapper bars, the J-bolt kind and = he moved the shocks inside himself. The leafspings were stock. The Jan. 99 = issue of HOTROD has an article on this kit, and most of susption/chassic = companies sell a kit for this. But you can very easily do it yourself. Weld a piece of steel (1080 = cold roll steel it's cheap and close, of not what the rear frame rails are made = of) at least 2inch. square or round .188 to 1/4(.250) wall thickness. In between the rear frame rails behind or infront the rearend. I've = seen it both ways, It's hooks alittle harder if it's behind the rearend. Most traction bars have the lower shock mount welded to them, you move the left = traction bar to right and vice virsa the get the lower mounting point inboard. And mount the top of the shocks to the new crossbar, in the = brackets you add to it. You have to get shocks that have both ends like the = lowers, not the stud type upper factory ones. You also have to tilt the shocks inwards towards top because of the lack of room (the way the mopar's = are). This is kinda hard to expain but onece you see a picture it's not so bad. I would like to know more about your strip car and it's setup. I am planing to get some edlebrock heads for a 455 I have, and I'm looking at a = Dana 60 rear. I got a set of the new SSM weld in subframe connections and = am not happy with them. And I havn't heard anthing good about round port = headers for a firstgen. though. Hope this helps, John Costello
(back) Subject: Fast 69 f-bird all pontica From: <Studderin@aol.com> Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2001 23:38:46 EST He deserves pat on the back. http://members.nbci.com/Joey455/index.htm Check out the lemans on pics&friends page
(back) Subject: Re: 1969 Firebird Trans Am for sale. [Details] From: <Studderin@aol.com> Date: Sat, 3 Mar 2001 00:12:21 EST In a message dated 3/3/2001 12:47:30 AM Eastern Daylight Time, pjd805@yahoo.com writes: << http://www.southernmotors.com/69ta.htm >> What I found interesting is the picture of the motor. Did anyone notice that the a/c compressor and the alternator are on opposite sides from the usual configuration[??]. Is this the typical arrangement for a RA T/A?? Was the accessory bolt-up that much different from say a PETE That's weid????? Did you also notice the tilt steerting column.???? Is that a opion? JohnCostello